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The Dead Puck Era's top scorers

On the day Joe Sakic officially announces his retirement, I figured this was a fitting way to highlight just how prolific he was during his career. Over the past 20 NHL seasons, Sakic is the highest scoring player in the league, and since the start of the Dead Puck Era in 1994-95, he's right among the leaders:

Rk Player   From To     GP   G   A    Pts PPG  +/- 
1 Jaromir Jagr  1995 2008       962    521    759    1,280 1.33 222
2 Joe Sakic  1995 2009       917    410    667    1,077 1.17 138
3 Teemu Selanne  1995 2009       997    478    548    1,026 1.03 104
4 Mats Sundin  1995 2009    1,022    429    586    1,015 0.99 94
5 Paul Kariya  1995 2009       914    384    562       946 1.04 38
6 Mark Recchi  1995 2009    1,075    338    595       933 0.87 1
7 Mike Modano  1995 2009    1,007    370    557       927 0.92 153
8 Daniel Alfredsson  1996 2009       932    355    566       921 0.99 147
9 Keith Tkachuk  1995 2009       950    453    440       893 0.94 60
10 Peter Forsberg  1995 2008       706    249    636       885 1.25 242
11 B. Shanahan  1995 2009    1,011    432    443       875 0.87 152
12 Markus Naslund  1995 2009    1,046    391    467       858 0.82 9
13 Doug Weight  1995 2009       969    226    629       855 0.88 -31
14 Jarome Iginla  1997 2009       942    409    442       851 0.90 65
15 Alex Kovalev  1995 2009    1,010    351    496       847 0.84 -24
16 Joe Thornton  1998 2009       836    265    577       842 1.01 114
17 Nicklas Lidstrom  1995 2009    1,082    200    640       840 0.78 323
18 Sergei Fedorov  1995 2009       936    330    477       807 0.86 143
19 Rod Brind'Amour  1995 2009    1,002    295    500       795 0.79 -15
20 Jason Arnott  1995 2009       958    331    428       759 0.79 73

Pretty impressive, no?

Star-divide

Sakic had a pretty good stretch there from 1996 to 2002, when he won two Stanley Cups, a Conn Smythe, a Hart Trophy, Olympic gold and Olympic MVP. Over that span, he had 249 goals, 382 assists and 631 points in 508 games, the equivalent of 73 games, 36 goals, 55 assists and 90 points a season between the age of 26 and 32.

One year, he averaged nearly 26 minutes of ice time a game, which could be a record for a forward in the modern era. Two years ago, he became just the second player in league history to score 100 points at the age of 36 or older. (Gordie Howe was the first when he notched 103 points at age 40 in 1968-69.)

On the whole, there's a pretty solid argument that Sakic was the game's best player for a sizable window there. Or at least somewhere close to it.

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Comments

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Sakic

I always thought that if there was an argument as to who was the best the last 15 years or so it was between Sakic and longtime fellow Av, Forsberg. Forsberg had a higher PPG ratio and often seemed to be the media’s pick. However, at some point you have to play the game to be the best, and Sakic until the last two years, always played the game, while Forsberg unfortunately was hobbled for a substantial number of games. If you could pick a player at the start of the year I would have chosen Sakic over any of these players because I he would play almost all of the games, in any situation, and produce at the top end.

by sctlaw on Jul 9, 2009 10:42 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sakic was the greater player, but Forsberg was the better player.

Sakic meant more to the franchise for the reasons you state, but Forsberg had that magic of making everyone around him light years better than they were.

by thedoctor on Jul 9, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This from The Denver Post.

http://www.denverpost.com/avalanche/ci_12790075

Sakic is to the dead puck era what Mike Bossy was to the previous genereation. A deadly quick release, with deadly accuracy.

by cubanpuckstopper on Jul 9, 2009 11:10 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Interesting that you consider the last 4 years to be part of the “Dead Puck” era…I could see the last 2 years, but not the first two out of the lockout.

Still, Sakic was amazing. Also one of the most clutch playoff performers of his era/generation. Hell, of all time.

by Make a play Whitner on Jul 9, 2009 11:13 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

The first two seasons after the lockout were still lower in goals per game than a couple other years I’ve included. And they were only higher scoring than average DPE years due to a boatload of power plays.

Hockey in the ’80s averaged 7.34 goals per game or more. In 2005-06 and 2006-07, the NHL averaged about 6.00 per game.

Blogging on hockey at fromtherink.com

by James Mirtle on Jul 9, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

understood. It’s just kind of semantic difference of opinion, that’s all. While 2005-2007 might have been lower scoring than in the 80’s and early 90’s, I’m assuming the other couple of years it was lower than were ‘95 and ’95-’96…when scoring started to dip, but I wouldn’t really consider those years “dead puck” either. To me, and to each their own as far as classifying this stuff goes, the “dead puck era” was 96/97-03/04.

by Make a play Whitner on Jul 9, 2009 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think that lockout shortened season, with the Devils sweeping the Red Wings to the Cup, was the real start of things. Hasek won the Hart a few years later, save percentages climbed dramatically, etc.

I look at the big events as signifying the start of the Era. New Jersey’s rise was it.

Blogging on hockey at fromtherink.com

by James Mirtle on Jul 9, 2009 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Two amazing things on this list, IMO:

1) the presence of a defenseman, in Nick Lidstrom. That’s phenomenal.

2) the presence of Alex Kovalev on any sort of ‘leaders’ list.

by Habs on Jul 9, 2009 11:21 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I was similarly surprised to see Lidstrom pop up here.

by hallock on Jul 9, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

and ahead of Fedorov of all people.

"Life is just a place where we spend time between games. Hockey is where we live, where we can best meet and overcome pain and wrong and death." - Fred Shero

by Karina on Jul 9, 2009 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fed did end up playing in offensively-challenged Columbus for a while, and less games than Lidstrom (holding out on a contract will do that to a guy!). His PPG is higher, though.

Not to take anything way from the general impressiveness that his Lidstrom, though.

by RedBirdie on Jul 10, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well timed post James-yesterday Pratt and Taylor were discussing how Sakic wasn’t an “elite” player. Dicks.

by yrmom on Jul 9, 2009 11:44 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Short memories.

Blogging on hockey at fromtherink.com

by James Mirtle on Jul 9, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is there a way to listen to that?

2008-2009 Avalanche: It's like watching a car crash.

by Drakenlot on Jul 9, 2009 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your sanity is safer if you ignore them entirely.

'Nucks Misconduct - Housing Swedish Millionaires Since 2000.

by Yankee Canuck on Jul 9, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

They’re just upset that “Burnaby Joe” didn’t play near his hometown.

by DarrenM on Jul 9, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not an “elite” player? Huh, you would have thought Joe Sakic played for the Leafs.

Supporter of the Sergei Berezin "Give and Go" - You give me puck, then you go to hell

by bkblades on Jul 9, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don’t even get them started on the Leafs.

by yrmom on Jul 9, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

heh

Pratt’s a plagiarist (and a moron) so no one should get too worked up over what he or his partner say. A West Coast Leafs fan calls them Total Prat and Failure.

Pension Plan Puppets: A Toronto Maple Leafs blog and a group therapy session.

by PPP on Jul 9, 2009 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m always astounded that a)I’m listening to them and b)that neither seems to have read anything other than the Sun and the Province. How anyone can claim to know anything about sports and be ignorant as to the usefulness of the internet in covering them is beyond me.

by yrmom on Jul 9, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

In Edmonton, we at least stick to running down our own players as not being elite.

SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there)

by Doogie2K on Jul 9, 2009 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Rod Brind’Amour: -15 over the last 15 years!!!

Pardon the off topic. I just had to point that out, even if before this year, that number was around a +30.

by Afino on Jul 9, 2009 12:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

What a monster Jagr is….And imagine if he didn’t mail it in through some of his Washington years (in his prime).

Pensburgh.com -- it's like the Max Talbot of blogs*

*not just because we only work for 12 minutes a night

by Hooks Orpik on Jul 9, 2009 12:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

If he hadn’t, then with all possible respect to Sakic, Joe would have been at best #2.

I've been looking at the sky

by Back In Black on Jul 9, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Indeed. Jagr was always a virtuoso, and I shudder to think what he could have accomplished back in the days of freewheeling offense and bumbling, standup goaltenders.

"Sweet Zarley Zalapski, Batman!"

by ZarleyZalapski on Jul 9, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or if everyone convinced him every period was the third

by DrPainDDS on Jul 9, 2009 2:57 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Jagr going to the Capitals was such a fiasco for everyone involved: the Caps, Pens, Jagr, and even the NHL as a whole. He completely disappeared there, and although he still averaged around a point/game, he fell off the hockey map, it seemed.

He likely lost around 60-80 points over those 3 seasons (look at his numbers compared to the year before and year after), and if so, he probably wouldn’t have left to go to Russia before last season as he’d have a clear shot at finishing his career as the second highest point-getter of all time.

by RCheli on Jul 10, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lidstrom

Of course everyone knows how amazing, and how amazingly consistent Lidstrom’s been, but seeing his name up here with these others still just makes me shake my head in … well, amazement. That +/- number, geez, even though I hate the stat, it’s pretty damned impressive.

And I have to add, despite the overall numbers I’d have preferred Joe on my team over Jaromir at every single opportunity, no hesitation.

by ChicoMaki on Jul 9, 2009 2:31 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Forsberg’s +/- per game is absolutely unbelievable. Everyone says he’s one of the best players of his era, but I’m starting to think that’s underrating him.

by RyanV on Jul 9, 2009 4:45 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

If he hadn’t, then with all possible respect to Sakic, Joe would have been at best #2.

Yup, and if my aunt had a unit, she’d be my uncle.

Sakic was clutch. Jagr one of the biggest dog-fckers in hockey history.

by garth the hoser on Jul 9, 2009 8:09 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

His two Cup winning years, he was just incredible. In ‘96 I fully expected him to break the single playoff season goal scoring record… he was so close going into the SCF, and I was mildly shocked when that didn’t happen. And in ’01 he just owned the Devils.

Those facts, and 8 playoff OT goals, say it all really.

Being a Leaf fan here requires one to be sufficiently lubricated... and truculent!

by stucky on Jul 9, 2009 8:19 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

And in ’01 he just owned the Devils.

Particularly Scott Stevens.

2008-2009 Colorado Avalanche: Dry Humping Mediocrity

by Mike @ MHH on Jul 10, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

On the whole, there’s a pretty solid argument that Sakic was the game’s best player for a sizable window there. Or at least somewhere close to it.

I’m going to go with “close to it.” Nick Lidstrom really was better than anyone else in this era. Note that you’ve posted a measure that should be nothing but forwards, and he’s on it.

by J. Michael Neal on Jul 10, 2009 1:58 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I would dispute the notion that we're still in the Dead Puck Era.

The thing is, goals do not correlate with excitement. It’s not something you can quantify. Yes, the Dead Puck Era as we know it, occurring roughly between the two lockouts, saw a sharp decline in scoring after the high-flying 70s and 80s, but really, that period was the true aberration. The Gretzky-Orr era was the highest-scoring one since the League’s first decade, fuelled by overexpansion, dilution of the talent base by two leagues, the abdication of good team defence, whether by lack of talent (the expansion Capitals) or lack of interest (Gretzky’s Oilers, particularly in the early days), and if we’re being perfectly honest, kind of bad goaltending. Say what you will about the pads, but goalies are still fitter, faster, bigger, and more positionally sound than they’ve ever been.

The Dead Puck Era, much like the Dead Ball Era in baseball, was about a style of play more than numbers. It was about teams dumping and chasing, clogging the neutral zone, and clutching and grabbing as much as they could get away with, which is to say, almost all the time. Just looking at the numbers, though, it was simply a correction (though clearly an overcorrection) of a trend that had seen NHL scoring hit eight goals per game in the early 80s. Let’s look back at the Original Six era, and take the year 1957-58, a year that saw Rocket Richard in decline, Gordie Howe in his prime, and Bobby Hull as a rookie. NHL offence that year: 5.59 GPG. Hell, go back a couple of years, to 1955-56, and the NHL GPG was just 5.07. Was the Original Six era another Dead Puck Era? I don’t think so; to hear those that were there tell it, it was the Golden Age of hockey.

If ever there was a Dead Puck Era prior to the interlockout period, it was in the late 1920s, when a series of rule changes led to the NHL’s lowest-ever offensive output. For example: 1927-28 saw just 3.8 GPG scored, with the highest-scoring team being the Montreal Canadiens, with just 116 goals in 44 games, the equivalent of 216 goals per game today. They were the only NHL team to average more than 200 goals/82 GP. That, my friends, is a Dead Puck Era.

So while the NHL’s numbers aren’t exactly up to the Gretzky-Orr era for pure offence, the game is visibly better than it was before the lockout, and that’s what’s really important, not some perceived notion that the goal-per-game output must be this high.

SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there)

by Doogie2K on Jul 10, 2009 9:11 AM CDT reply actions   2 recs

It’s not an easy thing to quantify though. I always looked at the Devils Cup win in ‘95 as the start of the Era, but then scoring was higher than it’s been the past two seasons.

Did the DPE end postlockout because they called far more penalties and there were a huge number of power play goals? Or is it ongoing? Goal scoring has continued to fall off since 2005-06 — where will it go next?

Blogging on hockey at fromtherink.com

by James Mirtle on Jul 10, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Like I said, I don’t think it’s about goals at all, but style of play. The Devils’ success in the shortened season paved the way for a lot of teams using defence-first-last-and-always tactics after 20 years of high-flying offence (despite the fact that the Devils were actually a pretty high-scoring team; that’s the dynasty-era Montreal Canadiens transition game right there), with the increased tolerance for obstruction feeding right into that. The metric asston of penalties in 05-06 did beget a similar amount of goals, but the effect has also been to reduce clutching and grabbing, to the point where referees practically have to make things up to meet their (perceived) penalty quota these days. The stretch pass, combined with the reduced obstruction, has made it easier to beat the trap. Also, it could be perception bias, but it seems that particularly on good teams, there’s a lot less dump-chase-grind for the puck, and more skating the puck over the line and either attacking from the rush or setting up from the circle or behind the net — the “puck possession” game.

So I do think the lockout changes brought an end to the DPE style of play, though you could certainly counter that by pointing out the number of goals these days that bounce off six different things before finding the back of the net. The fact that offence hasn’t ballooned isn’t really relevant to that argument, because as I pointed out above, the scoring level of the current era is basically the same as that of the mid-Original Six era, generally regarded as a pretty good era for hockey.

Put another way, where does the scoring level “need” to be in order to stop the hand-wringing? 6 GPG? 6.5? 7?

SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there)

by Doogie2K on Jul 10, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let’s put it this way: I believe at one point I wrote that 2007-08 was the sixth-lowest scoring campaign in the past 50 years (!).

If that’s not Dead Puck, what is? That span of five years that were lower?

Blogging on hockey at fromtherink.com

by James Mirtle on Jul 10, 2009 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think we’re stuck with a fundamental philosophical difference here: I define it based on style of play, while you seem to define it based on goal-per-game numbers. The number of goals doesn’t matter to me in defining a DPE, so much as the relative lack of boring hockey. (Again, going back to the Dead Ball Era, there were reasons, some stylistic, some equipment-related, for a lack of offence and home runs.) That’s perfectly fine; that just means it’s not worth persuing a further argument because we’re coming at it from two different places. =)

SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there)

by Doogie2K on Jul 11, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You’re so right. Goaltending used to be much more positional — they’d determine where the shot was coming from, stand there, and hope to stop the puck with a flailing pad or stick. I love watching old games on the NHL Network, and it’s amazing how many goals would, by today’s standards, be considered easy shots misplayed by the goalie.

And the quality of defensemen — as well as the defensive schemes — has greatly improved. There could’ve been a hook/hold/interference called on every single offensive rush in that era. It really made for a lot of ugly games.

by RCheli on Jul 10, 2009 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pre-butterfly era goal-tending was somewhat brutal to watch (as a goaltender myself). Literally the most inefficient, lowest-average save techniques and save selections were utilized 95% of the time by the vast majority of the league’s goalies. Goaltender movement was nowhere NEAR the level it is today. Conditioning either, though that’s true at every position. Plus, most goalies didn’t utilize game film and preparation, even the rudimentary aspects that were available prior to the digital age.

2008-2009 Colorado Avalanche: Dry Humping Mediocrity

by Mike @ MHH on Jul 10, 2009 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs


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